Oct 13, 2023
How A Lecturer Targeted Jewish Students And Even Minimized The Holocaust
A Stanford University is accused of downplaying the Holocaust and separating out students based on "backgrounds and identities."
- 15 minutes
There are lots of additional costs
to hateful terrorist attacks like
that carried out by Hamas.
Not just in the immediate lives lost, or
even the trauma that will last
a lifetime for the friends and
family members who lost loved ones, or
even worse, were forced to witness it.
[00:00:15]
It spreads across the world.
It stokes hatred and bigotry and
in this case, antisemitism,
which seems to continually rear
its head around the world.
Whenever Jewish people feel like they
have a place, they can feel safe.
Just one very small case in point.
[00:00:32]
This just happened at
Stanford University here in America.
Stanford University has suspended
a lecturer following accusations that he
directed Jewish students in his
class to stand in the corner and
described Israelis as colonizers.
Students in one of the classes recounted
the lecturer blaming the outbreak of
[00:00:51]
violence between Israel and
Hamas on Zionists and
saying Hamas's actions
were part of a resistance.
He then asked Jewish students
to raise their hands and
separated them from their belongings,
explaining that he was simulating
what Jews were doing to Palestinians.
[00:01:07]
Israeli student leader Nourya Cohen
told the San Francisco Chronicle.
Cohen said the lecturer asked students how
many people had died in the Holocaust.
When one student answered six million, the
lecturer replied yes, only six million.
Students said the lecturer told them
more people died as a result of
[00:01:24]
colonialism than in the Holocaust and
that colonization was
what happened to Palestinians,
Cohen and Andrei Mandelshtam added.
They also said students recalled
the lecturer separating people in
both classes into different groups
based on their identities and
backgrounds and
calling them colonizers and colonized.
[00:01:41]
Greenberg said he'd spoken to three
students who attended the class,
citing their accounts,
said that the lecturer had said
colonizers killed more than six million.
Israel is a colonizer.
For the record,
look at this image I saw on social media.
But it's accurate and it I think,
makes a very stark point.
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Israel is the tiny blue spot,
you can barely even see it,
it's in the upper right
of the middle there.
Arab world is in green.
Tell me more about how Israel
is colonizing Arab land.
I think that characterization
personally is ridiculous.
In a statement, Stanford University said,
without prejudging the matter,
[00:02:17]
this report is a cause for
serious concern.
Academic freedom does not permit
the identity based targeting of students.
The instructor in this course is not
currently teaching while the university
works to ascertain
the facts of the situation.
This new outbreak of
violence between Hamas and
Israel has led to a spike in
tensions on US college campuses.
[00:02:33]
With a truck this week driving
around Harvard, for example,
identifying students it said had signed
a document blaming Israel for the war.
Very, very scary to just
see groups demonized
unfairly, and for
that to come to our shores.
[00:02:52]
>> Speaker 2: Yeah, well, Ben okay,
I don't agree with the graphic.
I'll tell you why I don't agree with
the graphic here in a second, and
I think that Israel is
colonizing Palestinians.
But we'll get to that,
that's a different and important question.
But that doesn't justify
anything this professor did.
[00:03:12]
What he did was mental.
What are you doing?
First of all,
Jewish Americans are not Israelis.
It's ridiculous,
it makes us sound like they have
a loyalty to a different country.
No, there are our brothers and
sisters, okay?
And they're Americans,
they're 100% Americans.
Second of all, never separate people
based on race, religion, what is that?
[00:03:31]
The Jews go over there, are you insane?
That's a lunatic thing to do.
And it wouldn't be right if you said the
Muslims go over there, or the Christians,
the Buddhists, the Hindus, etc.
But honestly, especially the Jews,
the last time people did that,
it didn't end well.
So this professor is out of his mind and
I don't know why
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we're having a conversation of
colonization versus Holocaust.
They're both terrible,
why are you comparing the two?
What is the fact that colonists,
even if colonization was worse and
I hate this conversation entirely about
what's worse, they're both horrible.
[00:04:04]
Even if it was worse, what's your point?
Does that make the Holocaust okay?
No, the Holocaust is one of the worst
things that has ever happened in humanity.
So the professor is a billion
percent wrong on everything.
[00:04:21]
Now, having said that, Ben,
the problem with that graphic is,
okay, but nobody said they're
colonizing all the Arab land, right?
And you can't colonize any of the land,
even if it was a tiny part.
Here I'll give you an example
from my background, right?
[00:04:38]
So the Turks,
in the middle of the Syrian civil war,
decided they were gonna take a portion of
northern Syria as a buffer zone, okay?
And I spoke out against that and
I said that, do not stay.
I don't think they should have
gone in the first place, but
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they definitely shouldn't stay.
Now, you could say the Turks
could turn around and say,
look at all this other Arab land,
the stuff in green, we didn't take all
of it, we just took a portion of Syria.
That doesn't justify it.
Now luckily, in that case,
they did go back, okay?
But you see what I'm saying?
You don't have to take all the land,
any land you take is not right.
[00:05:12]
And Israel's not taking Gaza and
West Bank, but
in terms of whether it's colonizing it,
they're occupied.
They don't control their own territory, so
it's a colonization of a sort, for sure.
>> Speaker 1: I disagree completely,
because colonization typically connotes
[00:05:29]
that somebody's trying to exploit
the resources of a land, trying to extend
their territory into foreign distant
lands, trying to get monetary gain of it.
>> Speaker 2: The Turks when
they colonized the Middle East,
they colonized the people right next to
them first, and then Eastern Europe, etc.
[00:05:45]
>> Speaker 1: Sure, but
land that is not theirs is my point.
Distant that is land that is Israel's.
>> Speaker 2: West bank and Gaza.
>> Speaker 1: Israel won this land in
the 1960s when they were attacked.
>> Speaker 2: But
that's old school Ben, old school is,
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I won your land now I keep it.
In the modern world, we're saying,
we don't do that, don't do that.
What do you mean, why is Israel the only
country that is held to that standard?
>> Speaker 1: No, everybody-
>> Where's America giving back the land we
took, where we won in war.
>> So we could have kept Iraq,
right, and we did all of America.
[00:06:15]
>> We keep our other areas.
>> Speaker 2: And that distinction
there is between the modern world and
the backwards world, right?
And we all lived in the backwards
world back then, right?
And so countries and empires as a matter
of course, Ben is right, would come in and
take other people's lands and
they wouldn't give it back, right?
[00:06:35]
That was the old way of doing things.
But what we're saying is in the modern
world, we wanna be better than that.
>> Speaker 1: Sure, but
the biggest issue I have with how
you're characterizing it is that.
I don't think it makes it in any way
sense to say it is colonialism, because
[00:06:50]
they literally are doing this simply for
their self defense and protection.
And the Palestinian people that then
move into Israel live perfectly fine
with Israelis.
And whether you like it or not, in 2005,
Israel completely withdrew from
the occupation in Gaza and kept security
[00:07:09]
control over the area only because of
what you just saw happen this Saturday.
Even with security control,
the government in charge wants to
annihilate the Jewish people
from the land of Israel 100% and
refuses to negotiate with
them a peace agreement.
[00:07:27]
That's literally like saying somebody
beats the crap out of you and
you respond by pulling out a gun on them.
And you're a colonialist now,
you're infringing on their rights.
No, they've infringed on your rights and
you're protecting yourself.
[00:07:42]
They have no interest in
those little swaths of land.
>> Speaker 2: Every single
empire says the same thing.
So the Turks said, yeah, of course
the Greeks are impinging upon our land,
the Syrians are impinging upon our land.
And then they went and kicked their ass
and took their land and colonized them.
So in this case, you're not wrong.
[00:08:00]
Yeah, there was a war and
the Palestinians killed the Israelis,
the Israelis killed the Palestinians and
the Israelis won that land.
But I'm hoping that in a decent society,
they give it back.
Is it just for security?
[00:08:15]
I know that that's the argument
that you're making, but
the rest of the world does not see
it that way and I do not see it.
>> Speaker 1: Right, but
that's exactly what I take issue with,
why does the world and
you not see it that way?
What interest does Israel have in
these two tiny swaths of land?
What does that do for them?
>> Speaker 2: Water, etc.
[00:08:31]
>> Speaker 2: But they gave-
>> Nonsensical religious beliefs.
>> Speaker 1: Nonsensical religious
beliefs is exactly what the problem is why
they have to keep security control over
Gaza even though they did give back that.
>> Speaker 2: When do you give it back?
Ever, ever, ever
>> Speaker 1: When there's not a terrorist
[00:08:47]
organization running.
>> Speaker 2: No you gonna call everybody
that the Palestinians pick terrorists,
tou know that.
>> That is not true.
All right, then why don't you
give the west-
>> Negotiate.
>> Israel, not you, why doesn't
Israel give back West Bank right now,
not led by a terrorist
organization led by a Fatah?
>> Speaker 1: Because the Netanyahu
government currently does not
[00:09:04]
want to negotiate for a two state
solution and that is their fault.
That they're wrong on that,
yes, absolutely.
I don't think they have a great
negotiating partner on the other side,
but they are a partner
you can negotiate with.
I mean, Secretary Blinken just went and
met with the leader of
the Palestinian Authority.
[00:09:20]
He did not meet with the leader of
Hamas because these are terrorists.
And so when there are people you can speak
with, that's why Israel does continually
and historically and even in recent
history goes to the negotiating table.
>> Speaker 2: Yeah.
>> Speaker 1: Israeli people don't
wanna live under the constant
[00:09:37]
threat of missiles and rockets and buses
blowing up and random suicide attacks.
We would much rather have peace.
>> Speaker 2: I know, but
Israel is going about it the wrong way,
if the occupation is permanent,
the threat is permanent.
Whereas when you actually make peace
deals like Israel did with Egypt,
[00:09:53]
they haven't had any bloodshed since
the peace deal that was 40, 50 years ago,
>> Why, because they made a peace deal.
>> Speaker 1: So do the peace deal.
>> Speaker 1: With Hamas?
>> Speaker 2: Yes, definitely with Hamas.
>> How, will they say they will negotiate?
>> Easy, no, that's not true at all.
Ben, look, hold on.
[00:10:10]
I can give a hundred examples,
maybe thousands of examples of
the other side being butchers and
we make peace deals, okay?
So I'll give you one that
happened here in America.
During the Civil War, the Confederacy
was monstrous to the Northerners.
[00:10:26]
When they captured white soldiers,
sometimes they would murder them,
sometimes they would lynch them, etc.
But oftentimes with the white soldiers,
they gave some quarter.
But if they captured Northern black
soldiers, they would mutilate them.
[00:10:42]
They were absolute monsters, and
we did a peace deal with them because
you don't get to negotiate with angels.
You negotiate with monsters that
are killing you on the other side.
>> Speaker 1: There was never
a charter from the Confederacy saying
that their goal is to eradicate.
[00:10:59]
>> Speaker 2: America,
that's exactly what their charter said.
>> Speaker 1: Black people
from the face of the earth.
>> Speaker 2: They kept them as slaves,
that was literally their charter,
was, we are gonna keep
these people as property.
What's worse than that?
We're gonna keep them as slaves,
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their charter was the most despicable
thing in American history.
But we still made peace cuz
that's how peace works.
>> Speaker 2: Of course, but
they didn't make the peace
agreement during the Civil War.
They didn't make the peace agreement
on the week that they were currently
slaughtering former slaves that
were fighting for the union.
[00:11:33]
They did it after
the resolution of the war.
So I'm glad then that you agree with me,
that the war needs to be resolved and
then there needs to be a willingness
from the other side to negotiate.
>> Speaker 2: Ben, the war is not resolved
today because of the current war that
Hamas started.
Ben is right about that.
But we could two weeks ago,
two months ago, two years ago,
[00:11:51]
I could have picked 2000 spots
where I would say, well, you've got
the occupation, nobody's bombing
anyone today, let's do a peace deal.
And Ben already said it Netanyahu and
the right wing government said, no,
they don't want it.
Well, you have to get to peace, but
you have to let them go Ben, you have to.
[00:12:13]
>> Well, but
also in an attempt to normalize relations
like you're suggesting, even with
Hamas and this certainly backfired.
Netanyahu's government was through Qatar,
was allowing funds,
was giving funds to Hamas to gain
better control, to be able to govern
[00:12:30]
their own people better and
was trying to normalize relations.
And look how that worked out, they came
and slaughtered people in their homes,
kids and babies and old people.
I got to go to Jackson, but Ben,
80% of Palestinians need assistance
because they don't control their
own country in Gaza Strip.
[00:12:47]
They don't control their own countries,
so nothing is allowed in,
nothing is allowed out,
so they're starving.
>> Speaker 1: That is not why, the border
with Egypt they could allow anything and
Egypt controls that just as
hard if not harder than Israel.
>> Egypt and Israel are 100% allies.
[00:13:03]
When Israel says close the border,
Egypt closed the border.
>> Speaker 1: The hatred that comes out
in anti Semitism just only comes towards
the Jews, nobody's saying Egypt is being
colonial, Egypt is not allowing the-
>> By the way, that's a fair point and
a lot of pressure should go on Egypt.
>> Speaker 1: It 100% should, but
also you can't in the moment of something
try to expect people to negotiate with
[00:13:22]
people who are killing them,
that just doesn't make any sense.
And the reason that the resource are so
bad in Gaza is not because
Israel has a protection on
the outside of the territory.
They've given 17 years to this terrorist
organization to run things better and
[00:13:41]
they are hugely corrupt.
They funnel money to their rich buddies
within Gaza and let their people suffer.
They build no infrastructure,
they take water pipes and
turn them into rocket launchers.
They do not care about
keeping their people.
And in fact, right now, when Israel,
before this ground invasion,
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has been dropping leaflets and
making announcements and telling the UN.
Granted, it's very hard to move a million
people that quickly, but saying,
get out of there, move to the south,
we're gonna be coming in.
Hamas is saying, don't believe it, stay
where you are and telling them to keep in
place because they don't care about
the lives of their own people.
[00:14:12]
They would rather have them as shields
to be able to further their evil aims.
>> Speaker 2: Hamas is terrible, all
the things you say about Hamas are right.
They still should not try
to move 1.1 million people.
When the Turks moved that many Armenians,
it was called a genocide.
[00:14:29]
That's what it was called and
that's correct.
It was correctly labeled that, do not move
people and do not indiscriminately bomb.
>> Speaker 3: And I think it's pretty
clear that Israel has had interest in that
land and that doesn't justify
anything that Hamas has done.
[00:14:44]
But governments and
political factions always have interest,
geopolitical interest, in taking land.
So, I think to go back to where we
first started with the story of Israel
colonizing, you can't really justify that.
And then for this professor that had
people stand up, that's just ridiculous.
[00:15:02]
Not only is it ridiculous, but it's
really whack, it's petty and it's lame.
And I think that anybody who goes
down that road should be fired,
should be held to account.
And unfortunately, I think we're gonna see
quite a bit more of that in regards to,
again, right wing commentators
continuing dispute hate for
[00:15:18]
Jewish people and also for the
Palestinians, it's kind of full circle.
>> Speaker 2: That's a note
we could all agree on,
that what the professor did was incredibly
stupid and totally unacceptable.
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